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Новый вид Tk в 8.5

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[16:22]<kostix> Hi! A question regarding Tk in 8.5: since the next Debian will contain 8.5 as its "stable" Tcl/Tk, we've taken a glance at Tk 8.5 and noticed that it received that ugly "Windows-ish" checkboxes and radiobuttons in X. Is there a way (hack, etc) to revert to the "old" look for X? Or this can be only accomplished via Tile?

[16:25]<ijchain> * willdye recalls reading that it's indeed possible, without Tile, but can't recall the specifics...

[16:26]<jenglish> kostix -- the next Debian (etch), or the next next Debian?

[16:26]<kostix> jenglish: Etch

[16:26]<jenglish> I thought etch was in feature-freeze right now ...

[16:27]<jenglish> Wow. Where did you hear about this? (The debian-tcl list has been silent lately...)

[16:28]<kostix> jenglish: wait a bit, please. I'm now consulting with Tkabber PL, who maintains a bunch of Debian packages.

[16:30]<kostix> jenglish: sorry, Joe -- my fault; there will even be no 8.4.14 :(

[16:32]<kostix> jenglish: seems like just since 8.5 will be stable pretty soon, we'll support it (and it will be, of course, awailable for Debian)

[16:32]<kostix> So what about "old" look for plain 8.5 Tk? ;)

[16:32]<suchenwi> Maybe a Motif theme for Tile? :p

[16:34]<kostix> suchenwi: no Tile, Richard. Tkabber's look is "broken" right now, and there's no plans to port it to Tile right now, since there's no stable Tile

[16:35]<dkf> The problem with the old Motif look is that it can't show tristate values

[16:35]<dkf> i.e. "some selected, some not"

[16:36]<suchenwi> For Troolean logic?

[16:36]<kostix> suchenwi: +1 :)

[16:37]<suchenwi> like in SQL, the OR MAYBE NOT operator

[16:37]<kostix> WHO KNOWS

[16:38]<dkf> there's also the YES DEAR constant :)

[16:38]<kostix> :)

[16:38]<suchenwi> with the implementation "will probably not do"?

[16:38]<kostix> dkf: so, the answer to my particular problem is "no"?

[16:39]<dkf> 8.5 has capabilities that the old l&f could not support

[16:40]<dkf> so there's not much chance of going back; if nothing else, Mentor Graphics want the new functionality

[16:40]<kostix> Hm. After all, 8.5 has may vast improvements, so at least the pain of thansition is justified ;)

[16:40]<kostix> * many

[16:41]* dkf has just added _NET_WM_PING support to 8.5

[16:42]* dkf ... on the grounds that there's no reason to not do it, and it's transparent to scripts anyway

[16:48]<arjen> Mentor Graphics?

[16:48]<kostix> arjen: that's probably an euphemism ;)

[16:51]<arjen> Ah, those Anglosaxons!

[16:55]<spjuth> Mentor Graphics makes Modelsim, a simulator with a Tk GUI. Brian Griffin works there.

[16:56]<arjen> Now, that does ring a bell

[16:57]<dkf> Based in/near Portland, Oregon

[16:57]<arjen> Here is the WIki page: